Israeli "Battle Rations" update

[Bypah]

... Klingon

Wonder where they can get fresh " gagh"...

[Treesuit]

BB,

Thanks again for in depth investigating, that is some new info I didn't know about before. The battle ration sounds like a new improvement and more closely sounds like a US UGR or a post WWII 10-in-1 ration. Too bad we didn't have a couple of good pics.

The reason I say a UGR, is because of what BB described as a tray type mass feeding unit and heated up in the tray with chemical heaters.

[donaldjcheek]

Good analysis, BB.

I'm not sure if the new, individual Battle Ration Pack was issued during Cast Lead. All the pix I could find showed the standard 4-man Battle Ration.

Also, the new ration pack is not meant as a replacement for the standard 4-man Manot Krav. It's a specific-purpose ration, issued to infantrymen and not intended to be used more than 48 (or 72? - sources differ) hours, until normal supply lines catch up. Motorized troops, artillery units, and tank crews will all continue to use the group ration.

Several years ago the IDF did acquire some MREs, but decided they were too expensive, too heavy and not suited for the kind of combat the Israelis fight.

[rationtin440]

I'm curious; does anyone know if the IDF issues ration heating systems to their IFV and tank crews, and if so is it something similar to the ones issued to our forces for use in the hummers?

[Treesuit]

Several years ago the IDF did acquire some MREs, but decided they were too expensive, too heavy and not suited for the kind of combat the Israelis fight.

DJC, Really! I find that hard to believe seeing as how most other armies go to some lengths to get ahold of our MRE''s. It's also somewhat hard to think that the Israelis decided that the MRE's were too heavy and not suited for their version of combat. I seemed to recall that the last few times the Israelis went into Lebanon they were fighting a guerilla war with Hamas and Hezbollah. Individual meals seem more practical than a 4 man group ration. Also a MRE is a lot lighter than a heavy carboard, can heavy box.

Also, the new ration pack is not meant as a replacement for the standard 4-man Manot Krav. It's a specific-purpose ration, issued to infantrymen and not intended to be used more than 48 (or 72? - sources differ) hours, until normal supply lines catch up.

Okay so are we saying that this is only to be used for their commando, Special Forces, and paratrooper units? Under that idea it would seem more practical to issue the new ration out before they go into combat. Or do these units have their own supply lines? Something to think about.

[biscuits brown]

Guys special forces recce units and other special purpose units have another ration.
Even less on this than the new Battle Ration but it seems to be termed the Ambush Ration. Its basically a candy ration on steroids.
Seems to be on issue when NO field food preparation is to be tolerated due to the tac situation, like long term covert obs post work and similar.
Loads of specialist energy bars, energy drinks of different effects and dried fruit and nuts.
I dont know what it weighs, precise contents, packaging etc.
This seems to have been around for quite a while, before the 2008 Battle Ration.

Also with the Battle ration, Ive been trying to reconstruct what it probably looks like. Well, with the self heating entree tray, I imagine a kind of mini 1 man portion UGR express, with retort type and or freeze dried packaged sides. Kind of a hybrid of packaging techniques.
I WANT TO SEE ONE. I WANT TO SEE ONE NOW

[rationtin440]

Biscuits, that ambush ration sounds alot like what i recall reading about in that british military magazine which i cannot recall the title of but it was a series that discussed weapons, vehicles, and training from different countries. This issue I'm thinking of had a 2 man British recon hide and it described building it and what kind of weapons would be on hand. The rations were described as adequate but designed to not require much "elimination" which could give away the position.

[biscuits brown]

rt, I think thats probably a mag called Combat And Survival that you may have seen.

Used to be my fav "comic" when it first came out here in the UK in the late 80s

[donaldjcheek]

Treesuit

Just reporting what the Israelis themselves said. Also, never think the IDF does things the way we do, just because it seems like a good idea to us. The "communal spirit" is a lot stronger in IDF squads I've observed than in similar US squads. We're more individualistic than they are, and Army Logisticians were worried that individual rations might break down unit solidarity. (Fact! It was argued in the Knesset.)

The new ration - which I still can't find pictures of, nor a complete menu listing - is intended, as stated, for infantrymen, who will revert to the 4-man group ration as quickly as possible.

Your average tzahalnik is use to carrying pakalim out in the shetach as it is. BTW... ketchup & corn sandwiches seem to be an IDF favorite.

[biscuits brown]

Treesuit

The "communal spirit" is a lot stronger in IDF squads I've observed than in similar US squads. We're more individualistic than they are, and Army Logisticians were worried that individual rations might break down unit solidarity. (Fact! It was argued in the Knesset.)

Thats a fascinating point djc.
It was noticed by the Brits too as far back as the war. Individualism they argued was a double edged sword. It was good and bad. Good for initiative and explotation and sometimes bad for morale, with stronger personalities taking control of squads. Remember guys this was a mass conscript army not the US army of 2010, but its an interesting point.
Its surprising that 5 and 10 in 1 rations were so popular then with the US squads, but the group rations may have helped unit cohesion, through collective cooking, menu planning, etc. Also it was quality food for the time, much better than K or C rats.

Guys check out "The Sharp End" by John Ellis. Its an outstanding book about the US and British (and Canadian and Aus) armies in WW2 especially in NW Europe.